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[quote="Guest"]State education aid should be replaced with vouchers for the needy. Power to the people![/quote]
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Guest
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 3:26 pm EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
On the way home from work, someone made an interesting comment about the NJEA union dues. If Teacher's apply half of their union dues to pay for the health benefits, it would not impact the take home pay and would also makeup for the 1% extra they are being asked to contribute. The teacher on phone said her dues were $700 yearly. I doubt that NEA will ever agree to this, instead its better to squeeze more from their members instead of finding solutions that would help our students and teachers during this recession, I'm afraid.
Guest
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 2:53 pm EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
Guest 2 wrote:
I agree that the union sometimes hurts teachers and I'm sure many teachers don't agree with the union on everything, but I also think that when the hate mongering reaches the fevered pitch it is at now, that teachers must feel glad the union is there to fight for them.
The current climate is decidedly uncivil.
Actually, from the teachers I speak with they are blaming the union for a lot of the attitude we hear now. That they feel the union tactics are part of the problem of why things reached this point.
Guest 2
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 1:03 pm EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
I agree that the union sometimes hurts teachers and I'm sure many teachers don't agree with the union on everything, but I also think that when the hate mongering reaches the fevered pitch it is at now, that teachers must feel glad the union is there to fight for them.
The current climate is decidedly uncivil.
Guest
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 11:25 am EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
It's not even the teachers as much as the unions and as a result the teachers get a bad rep due to the union. Most teachers I know do not support the union and do not feel their agendas match the real needs. That there is too much expense they pay out to support the union functions that get them little in return.
Guest
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 11:19 am EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
The problem is he's cutting funding, but not mandates. A lot of municipal and school costs are related to unfunded mandates. He's looked at the dollars and said we're cutting Aid, but not helping us by looking at what the state requires and saying we're doing our part by no longer requiring you to do X, Y, and Z.
True. Looking at our school budget, a vast amount is spent on special instruction for a small group (almost 50% what we spend on regular instruction for less than 10% of the kids). And the largest funding of course is contracted terms for the teachers which are not defined locally. We can cut teaching positions but not make any changes to the terms so we can keep everyone. And the largest line item by far is the Princeton tuition which is also defined at the State level and is not open to negotiation by us. When you add up all the expenses mandated at the state level is represents a large majority of the total budget.
Correction-- the contracted terms for the teachers are ABSOLUTELY defined locally. The contract for teachers is between the Cranbury Education Association (the local union) and the Cranbury Board of Education -- it is negotiated between the teachers you know and the Board members you elected. When the state implies that teachers contracts are out of control -- note that they are saying that our local (well -liked) teachers and local (also well-liked) board members have all done terrible jobs.
I don't believe this. The governor's rhetoric and the media's piling on has spread falsehoods and implied that these contracts were negotiated in some backroom by people who are out to screw the taxpayers. IT IS NOT TRUE. DON"T BE FOOLED.
Our local teachers pay in for their health benefits, pay towards their pensions and are capped in the number of sick days they can carry. They have negotiated in good faith and the Board of Ed has looked out for the town well.
(and no -- I don't teach in Cranbury - I just take the time to understand how my tax dollars are spent.)
I think that this post says it all. The rank and file teachers are not the villains here. Too many Administrative positions (in general not in Cranbury) and the State and Federal Politicians and all their cronies are the ones to blame.
Guest
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 10:26 am EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
The problem is he's cutting funding, but not mandates. A lot of municipal and school costs are related to unfunded mandates. He's looked at the dollars and said we're cutting Aid, but not helping us by looking at what the state requires and saying we're doing our part by no longer requiring you to do X, Y, and Z.
True. Looking at our school budget, a vast amount is spent on special instruction for a small group (almost 50% what we spend on regular instruction for less than 10% of the kids). And the largest funding of course is contracted terms for the teachers which are not defined locally. We can cut teaching positions but not make any changes to the terms so we can keep everyone. And the largest line item by far is the Princeton tuition which is also defined at the State level and is not open to negotiation by us. When you add up all the expenses mandated at the state level is represents a large majority of the total budget.
Correction-- the contracted terms for the teachers are ABSOLUTELY defined locally. The contract for teachers is between the Cranbury Education Association (the local union) and the Cranbury Board of Education -- it is negotiated between the teachers you know and the Board members you elected. When the state implies that teachers contracts are out of control -- note that they are saying that our local (well -liked) teachers and local (also well-liked) board members have all done terrible jobs.
I don't believe this. The governor's rhetoric and the media's piling on has spread falsehoods and implied that these contracts were negotiated in some backroom by people who are out to screw the taxpayers. IT IS NOT TRUE. DON"T BE FOOLED.
Our local teachers pay in for their health benefits, pay towards their pensions and are capped in the number of sick days they can carry. They have negotiated in good faith and the Board of Ed has looked out for the town well.
(and no -- I don't teach in Cranbury - I just take the time to understand how my tax dollars are spent.)
Guest
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 9:10 am EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
Guest wrote:
The problem is he's cutting funding, but not mandates. A lot of municipal and school costs are related to unfunded mandates. He's looked at the dollars and said we're cutting Aid, but not helping us by looking at what the state requires and saying we're doing our part by no longer requiring you to do X, Y, and Z.
True. Looking at our school budget, a vast amount is spent on special instruction for a small group (almost 50% what we spend on regular instruction for less than 10% of the kids). And the largest funding of course is contracted terms for the teachers which are not defined locally. We can cut teaching positions but not make any changes to the terms so we can keep everyone. And the largest line item by far is the Princeton tuition which is also defined at the State level and is not open to negotiation by us. When you add up all the expenses mandated at the state level is represents a large majority of the total budget.
Guest
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 8:46 am EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
The problem is he's cutting funding, but not mandates. A lot of municipal and school costs are related to unfunded mandates. He's looked at the dollars and said we're cutting Aid, but not helping us by looking at what the state requires and saying we're doing our part by no longer requiring you to do X, Y, and Z.
Guest
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 8:24 am EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
Guest wrote:
Whatever Christie does has to pass muster with the supreme court, so you're not going to get a perfect plan. If Christie did what you're suggesting, he'd get crushed by the court for disproportiately affecting poor districts.
As it is, Trenton is losing $10 million and we are losing $600k. What Christie is doing is smart and sensitive. It's not that hard for the guy smoking two cigarettes a day to go cold turkey. The guy smoking 5 packs a day has to start somewhere.
If Christie does exactly the same thing next year (cut all aid up to 5% of each district's budget), Cranbury will receive a 0% cut and Trenton will lose another $10 million. Are you going to argue that that is unfair to Trenton?
If he does the same thing next year, he will still not be addressing the problems with the states budget. He will simply have our schools funded like they are in California. Oh hey they don't have any budget problems.
The fact remains he can cripple the schools and still have a huge state budget problem. So far we have just using a stop gap approach by further shifting the burden to local governments. Which by the by is what every governor since Florio has done.
Guest
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 7:06 am EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
Whatever Christie does has to pass muster with the supreme court, so you're not going to get a perfect plan. If Christie did what you're suggesting, he'd get crushed by the court for disproportiately affecting poor districts.
As it is, Trenton is losing $10 million and we are losing $600k. What Christie is doing is smart and sensitive. It's not that hard for the guy smoking two cigarettes a day to go cold turkey. The guy smoking 5 packs a day has to start somewhere.
If Christie does exactly the same thing next year (cut all aid up to 5% of each district's budget), Cranbury will receive a 0% cut and Trenton will lose another $10 million. Are you going to argue that that is unfair to Trenton?
Guest
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 12:55 am EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
That said, Christie can’t credibly claim he is pursuing a different goal than Corzine – just in a more up-front way.
Sure he can. Christie is cutting the overall budget. He is gradually detoxing New Jersey's municipalities and school districts from the drug of state aid. If Christie stays true to his mission, we will all pay less in taxes and receive less in rebates, state aid, etc.
But that's not consistent with the facts. First, because the opposite is true. It was never "state aid" -- it was local taxes re-distributed back locally by the state. And he is still collecting the same local taxes, he's just not giving as much of it back locally. More importantly, his policy disproportionately penalizes those local municipalities and school districts that were not deeply relying on the "drug of state aid" while least impacting those that were. As a result, he is actually further perpetuating the problem by taking an even higher percentage of taxes from places that most self-fund and giving it to places that don't. That's why Jamesburg will still get millions this year to fund a school district smaller than ours and had a smaller cut in both dollars and percentages while Cranbury, which sends far more to the state to give to schools and municipalities than it ever received back will get nothing.
If the goal, as you claim, were really to detox local districts from depending on state aid, wouldn't you reward or at least not penalize those least dependent on it? Isn't the message being sent now that you need to rely on aid as much as posisble so you can assure still getting the most after re-distribution? If the goal was really as you claim, why not have consistently cut the same percentage from all districts at the very least? It doesn't reward the responsible districts but at least its fair and doesn't penalize them while rewarding the irresponsible ones.
Guest
Posted: Wed, Mar 24 2010, 12:52 am EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
Guest wrote:
toenailcake wrote:
Hey.
Why not auction off naming rights for The Cranbury School to the highest bidder?
I mean, The Cranbury School is NOT very original nor creative.
How about, The Sun Bank School..........or..........The Prudential School................or The Exxon-Mobil School.
I like that one.
It'll raise much needed funds and teach our little ones that our nation REALLY is run for the almighty buck.
They may as well learn that lesson early on!
not relevant to this discussion, please stay on topic.
Sorry, Mr. Spock, for not being logical.
Guest
Posted: Tue, Mar 23 2010, 11:47 pm EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
That said, Christie can’t credibly claim he is pursuing a different goal than Corzine – just in a more up-front way.
Sure he can. Christie is cutting the overall budget. He is gradually detoxing New Jersey's municipalities and school districts from the drug of state aid. If Christie stays true to his mission, we will all pay less in taxes and receive less in rebates, state aid, etc.
By the way Christie has done nothing yet to address the "states" budget problem other than transfer money from local school aid to the state budget. In the case of Cranbury we still pay huge state taxes and get none of it back. Maybe he will be successful in restructuring state government, but this has nothing to do with that. This is a quick fix to try to remain solvent.
The state is still broken.
This "drug of state aide" is a particularly silly phrase. New Jersey funds its schools through property taxes more than other states.
Remember Christies first move was to stop this years budgeted funding to Cranbury because of excess surplus. Excess surplus is required by statute to be returned to the local tax payers at the end of the fiscal year. Effectively he took our local property taxes and transferred them to the state. If you think this is a good idea, you don't understand what is going on.
Guest
Posted: Tue, Mar 23 2010, 11:38 pm EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
State education aid should be replaced with vouchers for the needy. Power to the people!
Guest
Posted: Tue, Mar 23 2010, 11:31 pm EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
Guest wrote:
That said, Christie can’t credibly claim he is pursuing a different goal than Corzine – just in a more up-front way.
Sure he can. Christie is cutting the overall budget. He is gradually detoxing New Jersey's municipalities and school districts from the drug of state aid. If Christie stays true to his mission, we will all pay less in taxes and receive less in rebates, state aid, etc.
Guest
Posted: Tue, Mar 23 2010, 10:30 pm EDT
Post subject: Re: Cranbury Proposed State Aid and Education Cuts
toenailcake wrote:
Hey.
Why not auction off naming rights for The Cranbury School to the highest bidder?
I mean, The Cranbury School is NOT very original nor creative.
How about, The Sun Bank School..........or..........The Prudential School................or The Exxon-Mobil School.
I like that one.
It'll raise much needed funds and teach our little ones that our nation REALLY is run for the almighty buck.
They may as well learn that lesson early on!
not relevant to this discussion, please stay on topic.